<time>7_00:01:30,000 --> 00:01:30,720</time>
<s>聊聊什么问题呢</s>
<time>8_00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:34,680</time>
<s>我觉得聊聊这个马爷的这个形象</s>
<time>9_00:01:36,840 --> 00:01:38,640</time>
<s>体面</s>
<time>10_00:01:39,000 --> 00:01:41,160</time>
<s>我是一个不怎么讲究体面的人</s>
<time>11_00:01:41,520 --> 00:01:42,600</time>
<s>我现在这个桌前面</s>
<time>12_00:01:42,960 --> 00:01:44,760</time>
<s>他们给我找来个文</s>
<time>13_00:01:45,120 --> 00:01:46,200</time>
<s>六十五岁老戏骨</s>
<time>14_00:01:46,560 --> 00:01:47,640</time>
<s>直播被骂</s>
<time>15_00:01:48,720 --> 00:01:50,520</time>
<s>就是您知道那个直播带货的</s>
<time>16_00:01:50,880 --> 00:01:51,960</time>
<s>说是真是老戏骨</s>
<time>17_00:01:52,320 --> 00:01:53,400</time>
<s>老表演艺术家</s>
<time>18_00:01:53,760 --> 00:01:54,480</time>
<s>人家还是塑造过</s>
<time>19_00:01:54,840 --> 00:01:56,640</time>
<s>很多成功的那个角色</s>
<time>20_00:01:57,000 --> 00:01:58,080</time>
<s>说弄一个什么短视频</s>
<time>21_00:01:59,160 --> 00:02:01,680</time>
<s>这个演技当时你看了都能流泪</s>
<time>22_00:02:02,040 --> 00:02:02,760</time>
<s>那是真的有演技</s>
<time>23_00:02:03,120 --> 00:02:04,560</time>
<s>但是有一天他带货了</s>
<time>24_00:02:05,280 --> 00:02:05,640</time>
<s>带货</s>
<time>25_00:02:06,000 --> 00:02:06,360</time>
<s>直播带货</s>
<time>26_00:02:06,720 --> 00:02:07,440</time>
<s>因为人家就</s>
<time>27_00:02:07,800 --> 00:02:09,960</time>
<s>倪萍就说他这个</s>
<time>28_00:02:10,320 --> 00:02:12,120</time>
<s>上节目的衣服是租的</s>
<time>29_00:02:12,480 --> 00:02:13,200</time>
<s>他把冰箱里的鳕鱼</s>
<time>30_00:02:13,560 --> 00:02:14,280</time>
<s>放五年舍不得扔</s>
<time>31_00:02:14,640 --> 00:02:16,080</time>
<s>这怎么跟我爸似的</s>
<time>32_00:02:16,440 --> 00:02:17,880</time>
<s>他们所以也有人说了</s>
<time>33_00:02:18,240 --> 00:02:21,120</time>
<s>说这个有些年轻小偶像带货</s>
<time>34_00:02:21,480 --> 00:02:22,200</time>
<s>倒没那么多人骂的</s>
<time>35_00:02:22,560 --> 00:02:24,360</time>
<s>为什么一个老戏骨带货</s>
<time>36_00:02:24,720 --> 00:02:25,800</time>
<s>骂得人家下不来台</s>
<time>37_00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:27,960</time>
<s>人家这位老艺术家</s>
<time>38_00:02:28,320 --> 00:02:30,120</time>
<s>最后就是在这个直播上面</s>
<time>39_00:02:30,480 --> 00:02:31,200</time>
<s>给大家道歉</s>
<time>40_00:02:31,560 --> 00:02:33,000</time>
<s>还就说哭了</s>
<time>41_00:02:33,720 --> 00:02:34,440</time>
<s>给观众翰躬对吧</s>
<time>42_00:02:34,800 --> 00:02:37,680</time>
<s>就说我对表演是这个负责的</s>
<time>43_00:02:39,120 --> 00:02:40,920</time>
<s>因为人家说他为老不尊对吧</s>
<time>44_00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:44,520</time>
<s>他说看到有人说我晚节不保</s>
<time>45_00:02:44,880 --> 00:02:45,600</time>
<s>我好伤心</s>
<time>46_00:02:45,960 --> 00:02:47,760</time>
<s>三十多年我在演艺事业上</s>
<time>47_00:02:48,120 --> 00:02:48,840</time>
<s>蔬説业业</s>
<time>48_00:02:49,200 --> 00:02:51,360</time>
<s>努力演好每一个角色</s>
<time>49_00:02:51,720 --> 00:02:53,520</time>
<s>包括这次这直播带货</s>
<time>50_00:02:53,880 --> 00:02:57,480</time>
<s>我也是想用另外一种表演才能</s>
<time>51_00:02:57,840 --> 00:02:58,560</time>
<s>来表演一下</s>
<time>52_00:02:59,640 --> 00:03:01,800</time>
<s>随后关闭了直播间</s>
<time>53_00:03:02,160 --> 00:03:02,880</time>
<s>这事你都听说过吗</s>
<time>54_00:03:03,240 --> 00:03:04,320</time>
<s>我看到网上有</s>
<time>55_00:03:05,400 --> 00:03:06,480</time>
<s>我有时候觉得那些评论</s>
<time>56_00:03:06,840 --> 00:03:07,560</time>
<s>就是喷吧</s>
<time>57_00:03:07,920 --> 00:03:10,800</time>
<s>就他真的理解这个人做了什么</s>
<time>58_00:03:11,160 --> 00:03:12,600</time>
<s>或者好像我也不觉得</s>
<time>59_00:03:12,960 --> 00:03:14,040</time>
<s>他们我有时候</s>
<time>60_00:03:14,400 --> 00:03:15,480</time>
<s>对我是不是该挨骂了</s>
<time>61_00:03:16,200 --> 00:03:18,000</time>
<s>别怕很鼓励你这样</s>
<time>62_00:03:18,360 --> 00:03:18,720</time>
<s>没关系</s>
<time>63_00:03:19,080 --> 00:03:20,520</time>
<s>我觉得这种刻意地</s>
<time>64_00:03:20,880 --> 00:03:22,320</time>
<s>伤害别人本身就不体面</s>
<time>65_00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:24,480</time>
<s>就不体面的不是那老戏骨</s>
<time>66_00:03:24,840 --> 00:03:25,560</time>
<s>而是这些评论</s>
<time>67_00:03:26,640 --> 00:03:27,720</time>
<s>但是这篇文章的题目</s>
<time>68_00:03:28,080 --> 00:03:29,520</time>
<s>我觉得咱们真可以聊聊</s>
<time>69_00:03:29,880 --> 00:03:31,680</time>
<s>某种程度上马爷可能没这个问题</s>
<time>70_00:03:32,040 --> 00:03:32,760</time>
<s>许老师可能也没这个</s>
<time>71_00:03:33,120 --> 00:03:33,480</time>
<s>你可能也</s>
<time>72_00:03:33,840 --> 00:03:34,920</time>
<s>那就是我就有这问题</s>
<time>73_00:03:35,640 --> 00:03:37,800</time>
<s>说放下面子赚钱</s>
<time>74_00:03:38,880 --> 00:03:41,400</time>
<s>是成年人最大的体面</s>
<time>75_00:03:42,120 --> 00:03:44,640</time>
<s>对于一个需要养家糊口的人来说</s>
<time>76_00:03:45,000 --> 00:03:46,440</time>
<s>对吧对于一个要承担</s>
<time>77_00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:49,320</time>
<s>这个经济责任的一个男人来说</s>
<time>78_00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:51,480</time>
<s>当然可能也包括女人了</s>
<time>79_00:03:51,840 --> 00:03:54,360</time>
<s>就是说赚钱有什么丢人的</s>
<time>80_00:03:55,440 --> 00:03:57,240</time>
<s>赚钱没有什么可丢人的</s>
<time>81_00:03:57,600 --> 00:04:01,200</time>
<s>我老说当你走向这个世界</s>
<time>82_00:04:01,920 --> 00:04:02,280</time>
<s>你单独生存的时候</s>
<time>83_00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:04,080</time>
<s>第一个目的就是趋利</s>
<time>84_00:04:04,440 --> 00:04:05,160</time>
<s>你就是要赚钱</s>
<time>85_00:04:05,520 --> 00:04:06,240</time>
<s>你不赚钱你怎么生存</s>
<time>86_00:04:06,600 --> 00:04:07,320</time>
<s>你靠别人养着那更不体面了</s>
<time>87_00:04:07,680 --> 00:04:09,120</time>
<s>对自食其力就体面</s>
<time>88_00:04:09,480 --> 00:04:10,200</time>
<s>问题是怎么样赚钱</s>
<time>89_00:04:10,560 --> 00:04:11,280</time>
<s>它有两个前置</s>
<time>90_00:04:11,640 --> 00:04:13,440</time>
<s>第一个前置是大家要求的</s>
<time>91_00:04:13,800 --> 00:04:14,520</time>
<s>这个就是比较难做到的</s>
<time>92_00:04:14,880 --> 00:04:15,240</time>
<s>叫道德</s>
<time>93_00:04:16,680 --> 00:04:17,400</time>
<s>第二个前置是法律</s>
<time>94_00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:18,480</time>
<s>法律很简单</s>
<time>95_00:04:18,840 --> 00:04:19,920</time>
<s>法律就是你要触碰</s>
<time>96_00:04:20,280 --> 00:04:21,360</time>
<s>您就上那边受罚去</s>
<time>97_00:04:21,720 --> 00:04:22,440</time>
<s>你不触碰就没有事</s>
<time>98_00:04:22,800 --> 00:04:23,520</time>
<s>但道德这个事儿</s>
<time>99_00:04:23,880 --> 00:04:25,320</time>
<s>你到底触碰到什么程度</s>
<time>100_00:04:25,680 --> 00:04:26,400</time>
<s>这个很难说</s>
<time>101_00:04:26,760 --> 00:04:27,480</time>
<s>因为中国传统文化中</s>
<time>102_00:04:27,840 --> 00:04:30,000</time>
<s>对商是视的</s>
<time>103_00:04:30,360 --> 00:04:31,440</time>
<s>商人重利轻别离</s>
<time>104_00:04:31,800 --> 00:04:33,240</time>
<s>你一商人</s>
<time>105_00:04:33,600 --> 00:04:34,320</time>
<s>你就是为钱而走</s>
<time>106_00:04:34,680 --> 00:04:36,120</time>
<s>你跟感情没关系</s>
<time>107_00:04:36,480 --> 00:04:38,280</time>
<s>所以我们士农工商</s>
<time>108_00:04:38,640 --> 00:04:39,360</time>
<s>商一定扔在最后头</s>
<time>109_00:04:39,720 --> 00:04:41,520</time>
<s>所以商人在中国</s>
<time>110_00:04:41,880 --> 00:04:43,320</time>
<s>至少有文字记载的这个历史</s>
<time>111_00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:46,200</time>
<s>几千年中都是地位低下的</s>
<time>112_00:04:46,560 --> 00:04:47,640</time>
<s>所以当一个有成就的人</s>
<time>113_00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:48,360</time>
<s>你想想老戏骨</s>
<time>114_00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:50,160</time>
<s>他是属于在演艺上有成就</s>
<time>115_00:04:50,520 --> 00:04:51,240</time>
<s>你去经商</s>
<time>116_00:04:51,600 --> 00:04:53,040</time>
<s>那大家这就开始</s>
<time>117_00:04:53,400 --> 00:04:54,480</time>
<s>就文化开始起作用</s>
<time>118_00:04:54,840 --> 00:04:58,080</time>
<s>中国所有的社会现象你往根儿里刨</s>
<time>119_00:04:58,440 --> 00:04:59,160</time>
<s>一定跟文化有关</s>
<time>120_00:04:59,880 --> 00:05:01,320</time>
<s>那老戏骨</s>
<time>121_00:05:02,400 --> 00:05:03,120</time>
<s>可以挣钱</s>
<time>122_00:05:03,480 --> 00:05:04,200</time>
<s>但是什么钱能挣</s>
<time>123_00:05:04,560 --> 00:05:05,280</time>
<s>什么钱不能挣</s>
<time>124_00:05:06,000 --> 00:05:07,080</time>
<s>主要是这个问题</s>
<time>125_00:05:07,800 --> 00:05:09,240</time>
<s>对吧那我觉得一个人</s>
<time>126_00:05:09,600 --> 00:05:11,040</time>
<s>挣钱的方式非常多</s>
<time>127_00:05:11,400 --> 00:05:13,200</time>
<s>你比如说最简单的一个挣钱方式</s>
<time>128_00:05:13,560 --> 00:05:15,000</time>
<s>叫气讨是不是</s>
<time>129_00:05:15,360 --> 00:05:16,080</time>
<s>气讨也可以挣钱</s>
<time>130_00:05:16,440 --> 00:05:17,160</time>
<s>老戏骨可以气讨吗</s>
<time>131_00:05:19,680 --> 00:05:20,400</time>
<s>不是老戏骨了</s>
<time>132_00:05:20,760 --> 00:05:21,840</time>
<s>你比如说咱们做一测试</s>
<time>133_00:05:22,200 --> 00:05:23,280</time>
<s>我盘着一腿找一盆</s>
<time>134_00:05:23,640 --> 00:05:24,360</time>
<s>我找街边上去</s>
<time>135_00:05:24,720 --> 00:05:25,080</time>
<s>我说我过不下去了</s>
<time>136_00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:26,520</time>
<s>他肯定有人给你钱</s>
<time>137_00:05:26,880 --> 00:05:27,240</time>
<s>人家说马爷</s>
<time>138_00:05:27,600 --> 00:05:28,320</time>
<s>你怎么在这儿</s>
<time>139_00:05:28,680 --> 00:05:30,120</time>
<s>对人家马上回头看</s>
<time>140_00:05:30,480 --> 00:05:31,200</time>
<s>有没有摄像机是吧</s>
<time>141_00:05:31,920 --> 00:05:33,360</time>
<s>但是这个我现在说</s>
<time>142_00:05:33,720 --> 00:05:36,240</time>
<s>我老说你把一个事情推到极端</s>
<time>143_00:05:36,600 --> 00:05:38,400</time>
<s>就比较容易看出它的利弊</s>
<time>144_00:05:39,480 --> 00:05:40,920</time>
<s>如果我们说一个其他的挣钱方法</s>
<time>145_00:05:41,280 --> 00:05:42,000</time>
<s>那说我没这本事</s>
<time>146_00:05:42,360 --> 00:05:43,080</time>
<s>我没有这关系</s>
<time>147_00:05:43,440 --> 00:05:44,160</time>
<s>那你就很难</s>
<time>148_00:05:44,520 --> 00:05:45,240</time>
<s>但我推到极端</s>
<time>149_00:05:45,600 --> 00:05:47,040</time>
<s>气讨是挣钱的</s>
<time>150_00:05:47,400 --> 00:05:49,200</time>
<s>最没有办法的一个办法</s>
<time>151_00:05:49,560 --> 00:05:50,280</time>
<s>但是你要知道</s>
<time>152_00:05:50,640 --> 00:05:52,080</time>
<s>全世界靠气讨为生的人</s>
<time>153_00:05:52,440 --> 00:05:53,520</time>
<s>是一个庞大的数量</s>
<time>154_00:05:54,600 --> 00:05:55,320</time>
<s>对不对全世界哪个国家都有</s>
<time>155_00:05:55,680 --> 00:05:56,400</time>
<s>世界上最富的国家</s>
<time>156_00:05:56,760 --> 00:05:58,200</time>
<s>你都能看到气讨</s>
<time>157_00:05:58,560 --> 00:06:00,000</time>
<s>那么他为什么要气讨</s>
<time>158_00:06:00,360 --> 00:06:01,080</time>
<s>他为什么要气讨</s>
<time>159_00:06:01,440 --> 00:06:02,520</time>
<s>他自个儿算过他的成本</s>
<time>160_00:06:02,880 --> 00:06:03,240</time>
<s>这个成本是最低的</s>
<time>161_00:06:03,600 --> 00:06:06,120</time>
<s>而且可以维持他的生活对不对</s>
<time>162_00:06:06,480 --> 00:06:07,200</time>
<s>那但是别人就不行</s>
<time>163_00:06:07,560 --> 00:06:08,280</time>
<s>你有一个社会成就</s>
<time>164_00:06:08,640 --> 00:06:09,360</time>
<s>或者你有社会地位</s>
<time>165_00:06:09,720 --> 00:06:11,520</time>
<s>你肯定不能去做这个事儿</s>
<time>166_00:06:11,880 --> 00:06:13,320</time>
<s>所以你还是有一个选择</s>
<time>167_00:06:13,680 --> 00:06:14,400</time>
<s>所以挣钱的话</s>
<time>168_00:06:14,760 --> 00:06:17,280</time>
<s>就是因为我们不对这个直播</s>
<time>169_00:06:17,640 --> 00:06:18,360</time>
<s>因为现在的直播带货</s>
<time>170_00:06:18,720 --> 00:06:19,440</time>
<s>这事儿比较厉害</s>
<time>171_00:06:19,800 --> 00:06:20,880</time>
<s>就是我们不对这个而言</s>
<time>172_00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:23,040</time>
<s>其实你挣钱是有多种选择的</s>
<time>173_00:06:23,400 --> 00:06:24,120</time>
<s>你不是也这样吗</s>
<time>174_00:06:24,480 --> 00:06:25,560</time>
<s>今天让你出场的事儿多了</s>
<time>175_00:06:25,920 --> 00:06:28,080</time>
<s>你推的事儿多还是接的事儿多</s>
<time>176_00:06:28,440 --> 00:06:30,240</time>
<s>这个是存在很多误解的</s>
<time>177_00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:34,200</time>
<s>你肯定是推的多对不对</s>
<time>178_00:06:34,560 --> 00:06:35,280</time>
<s>很多事儿你不去</s>
<time>179_00:06:35,640 --> 00:06:36,360</time>
<s>你为什么不去呢</s>
<time>180_00:06:36,720 --> 00:06:38,160</time>
<s>为什么说他这个文说我呢</s>
<time>181_00:06:38,520 --> 00:06:38,880</time>
<s>它后面就有窦文涛</s>
<time>182_00:06:39,240 --> 00:06:39,960</time>
<s>不是你知道</s>
<time>183_00:06:40,320 --> 00:06:41,400</time>
<s>我不知道现在有些人写的</s>
<time>184_00:06:41,760 --> 00:06:42,120</time>
<s>我也不知道</s>
<time>185_00:06:42,480 --> 00:06:43,200</time>
<s>他是有根据还是没根据</s>
<time>186_00:06:43,560 --> 00:06:44,280</time>
<s>但是跟我相比</s>
<time>187_00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:45,720</time>
<s>我老觉得</s>
<time>188_00:06:46,080 --> 00:06:47,520</time>
<s>说得挺像又不太像似的</s>
<time>189_00:06:47,880 --> 00:06:48,960</time>
<s>就是说</s>
<time>190_00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:50,400</time>
<s>窦文涛最火的时候</s>
<time>191_00:06:51,480 --> 00:06:53,280</time>
<s>首先我也没有火的时候</s>
<time>192_00:06:54,720 --> 00:06:55,440</time>
<s>应该这样说</s>
<time>193_00:06:55,800 --> 00:06:57,240</time>
<s>窦文涛最火的时候还没有来</s>
<time>194_00:06:58,680 --> 00:07:00,480</time>
<s>是我是长衰不盛</s>
<time>195_00:07:01,560 --> 00:07:02,280</time>
<s>这是我的名言</s>
<time>196_00:07:03,000 --> 00:07:05,160</time>
<s>曾经说过他接广告有三大原则</s>
<time>197_00:07:05,520 --> 00:07:07,320</time>
<s>我一看我觉得我就支棱起来了</s>
<time>198_00:07:07,680 --> 00:07:10,560</time>
<s>说有损形象的广告不接</s>
<time>199_00:07:10,920 --> 00:07:13,440</time>
<s>不喜欢的商业广告不接</s>
<time>200_00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:16,320</time>
<s>没有档次的广告不接</s>
<time>201_00:07:16,680 --> 00:07:17,760</time>
<s>真相是什么</s>
<time>202_00:07:18,840 --> 00:07:21,360</time>
<s>是因为没（那么多）人找我拍广告好吧</s>
<time>203_00:07:22,800 --> 00:07:24,600</time>
<s>我没有那么多的选择</s>
<time>204_00:07:24,960 --> 00:07:26,040</time>
<s>他说得不是很准确</s>
<time>205_00:07:27,120 --> 00:07:27,840</time>
<s>但是它确实</s>
<time>206_00:07:28,200 --> 00:07:29,640</time>
<s>又有一种本质上的准确</s>
<time>207_00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:32,880</time>
<s>我是经历了这样一个过程</s>
<time>208_00:07:33,240 --> 00:07:33,600</time>
<s>但是你比如说</s>
<time>209_00:07:35,040 --> 00:07:36,840</time>
<s>但是当他母亲突生重病</s>
<time>210_00:07:37,200 --> 00:07:39,000</time>
<s>需要一大笔钱的时候</s>
<time>211_00:07:39,360 --> 00:07:40,080</time>
<s>他又开始松口</s>
<time>212_00:07:41,160 --> 00:07:43,680</time>
<s>接的都是他之前绝不会接的广告</s>
<time>213_00:07:45,120 --> 00:07:47,640</time>
<s>实际上这个时候我是有了这个心</s>
<time>214_00:07:48,000 --> 00:07:48,720</time>
<s>但是这个时候</s>
<time>215_00:07:49,080 --> 00:07:49,440</time>
<s>要不来了</s>
<time>216_00:07:49,800 --> 00:07:51,600</time>
<s>找我拍广告的人比以前还少</s>
<time>217_00:07:53,040 --> 00:07:56,640</time>
<s>然后甚至连别人的婚礼主持</s>
<time>218_00:07:57,000 --> 00:07:57,720</time>
<s>他都不放过</s>
<time>219_00:07:58,800 --> 00:07:59,160</time>
<s>人家找你去的</s>
<time>220_00:07:59,520 --> 00:08:01,320</time>
<s>那我可真没有</s>
<time>221_00:08:01,680 --> 00:08:03,120</time>
<s>不是我还是特别小的时候</s>
<time>222_00:08:03,480 --> 00:08:06,720</time>
<s>去帮别人主持过这个婚礼</s>
<time>223_00:08:07,080 --> 00:08:08,160</time>
<s>也没人请我主要是</s>
<time>224_00:08:08,520 --> 00:08:09,240</time>
<s>不是主要是请不起</s>
<time>225_00:08:11,400 --> 00:08:12,120</time>
<s>主要是请不起</s>
<time>226_00:08:12,480 --> 00:08:14,280</time>
<s>就是你在钱</s>
<time>227_00:08:14,640 --> 00:08:16,440</time>
<s>因为每个人都面临这个问题</s>
<time>228_00:08:16,800 --> 00:08:19,320</time>
<s>我曾经有一回是在中央台</s>
<time>229_00:08:19,680 --> 00:08:20,400</time>
<s>那时候说起来</s>
<time>230_00:08:20,760 --> 00:08:23,280</time>
<s>十几二十年前做过一次辩论</s>
<time>231_00:08:23,640 --> 00:08:25,440</time>
<s>辩论的时候那个对方</s>
<time>232_00:08:25,800 --> 00:08:28,680</time>
<s>是这个北大的这个考古系的</s>
<time>233_00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:30,480</time>
<s>他就说所有收藏家都是趋利的</s>
<time>234_00:08:31,560 --> 00:08:32,280</time>
<s>他最后就逼急了</s>
<time>235_00:08:32,640 --> 00:08:33,360</time>
<s>说出这么一句话</s>
<time>236_00:08:33,720 --> 00:08:36,240</time>
<s>然后大部分人会否定这句话</s>
<time>237_00:08:36,600 --> 00:08:39,120</time>
<s>因为在辩论当中你趋利</s>
<time>238_00:08:39,480 --> 00:08:40,560</time>
<s>按理说人家认为</s>
<time>239_00:08:40,920 --> 00:08:41,280</time>
<s>你这个人人品不好</s>
<time>240_00:08:41,640 --> 00:08:42,360</time>
<s>才去趋利</s>
<time>241_00:08:42,720 --> 00:08:43,080</time>
<s>我当时就接了这句话</s>
<time>242_00:08:43,440 --> 00:08:45,960</time>
<s>我说趋利本质上没有什么坏</s>
<time>243_00:08:46,320 --> 00:08:47,760</time>
<s>就是那每个人都应该是趋利</s>
<time>244_00:08:48,120 --> 00:08:49,560</time>
<s>让你的利益最大化</s>
<time>245_00:08:49,920 --> 00:08:51,000</time>
<s>但前置我一开始就说了</s>
<time>246_00:08:51,360 --> 00:08:52,440</time>
<s>两个道德和法律</s>
<time>247_00:08:52,800 --> 00:08:55,320</time>
<s>这个你不能去违反它这个</s>
<time>248_00:08:55,680 --> 00:08:56,760</time>
<s>尤其是法律对吧</s>
<time>249_00:08:57,120 --> 00:08:57,840</time>
<s>道德违反了以后</s>
<time>250_00:08:58,200 --> 00:08:59,640</time>
<s>你会受到道德的制裁</s>
<time>251_00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:00,720</time>
<s>它制裁理论上讲</s>
<time>252_00:09:01,080 --> 00:09:02,520</time>
<s>过去人认为是重的</s>
<time>253_00:09:03,240 --> 00:09:04,680</time>
<s>今天的人认为是轻的</s>
<time>254_00:09:05,040 --> 00:09:06,840</time>
<s>但法律不管是过去还是今天</s>
<time>255_00:09:07,200 --> 00:09:09,000</time>
<s>都会认为是重的对吧</s>
<time>256_00:09:09,360 --> 00:09:11,520</time>
<s>所以就是一定不要把这个</s>
<time>257_00:09:11,880 --> 00:09:13,680</time>
<s>就是趋利的人生的第一个目标</s>
<time>258_00:09:14,040 --> 00:09:14,760</time>
<s>这是所有人踏入社会的</s>
<time>259_00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:15,840</time>
<s>第一个目标</s>
<time>260_00:09:16,200 --> 00:09:18,720</time>
<s>变得一个很负面</s>
<time>261_00:09:19,080 --> 00:09:20,160</time>
<s>我觉得这就不好了</s>
<time>262_00:09:20,520 --> 00:09:21,600</time>
<s>不负面</s>
<time>263_00:09:21,960 --> 00:09:23,400</time>
<s>挣钱有什么可负面的</s>
<time>264_00:09:23,760 --> 00:09:24,480</time>
<s>体现你的能力</s>
<time>265_00:09:25,920 --> 00:09:28,080</time>
<s>对但是你比如说</s>
<time>266_00:09:28,440 --> 00:09:30,240</time>
<s>你看比如说真说这广告这个</s>
<time>267_00:09:30,600 --> 00:09:31,320</time>
<s>我现在想起来</s>
<time>268_00:09:31,680 --> 00:09:33,120</time>
<s>真的都是肠子都悔青的事儿</s>
<time>269_00:09:33,480 --> 00:09:34,200</time>
<s>就是说我</s>
<time>270_00:09:34,560 --> 00:09:37,080</time>
<s>你生活没有到贫困线</s>
<time>271_00:09:37,440 --> 00:09:39,240</time>
<s>挣扎在贫困线以下</s>
<time>272_00:09:39,600 --> 00:09:41,040</time>
<s>你要真是那么穷</s>
<time>273_00:09:41,400 --> 00:09:43,200</time>
<s>那我觉得说不上什么了对吧</s>
<time>274_00:09:43,560 --> 00:09:46,080</time>
<s>有钱只要合法咱就挣对不对</s>
<time>275_00:09:46,440 --> 00:09:48,240</time>
<s>但是当你觉得你这个</s>
<time>276_00:09:49,680 --> 00:09:51,480</time>
<s>也能过上一个一般日子的</s>
<time>277_00:09:51,840 --> 00:09:52,560</time>
<s>那个时候</s>
<time>278_00:09:52,920 --> 00:09:54,360</time>
<s>就是我年轻那个时候</s>
<time>279_00:09:55,800 --> 00:09:56,160</time>
<s>那我不知道</s>
<time>280_00:09:56,520 --> 00:09:58,320</time>
<s>你比如你为什么拒绝那个广告</s>
<time>281_00:09:59,400 --> 00:10:02,640</time>
<s>其实没那么什么高风亮节</s>
<time>282_00:10:03,000 --> 00:10:04,080</time>
<s>它很多具体因素</s>
<time>283_00:10:04,440 --> 00:10:05,520</time>
<s>它那是个治近视眼（手术）广告</s>
<time>284_00:10:05,880 --> 00:10:06,960</time>
<s>就是激光手术是不是</s>
<time>285_00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:07,680</time>
<s>激光手术</s>
<time>286_00:10:08,040 --> 00:10:08,400</time>
<s>好多人都做了</s>
<time>287_00:10:08,760 --> 00:10:09,480</time>
<s>但是在我年轻的时候</s>
<time>288_00:10:09,840 --> 00:10:10,560</time>
<s>那得是二十</s>
<time>289_00:10:10,920 --> 00:10:12,000</time>
<s>有点儿风险</s>
<time>290_00:10:12,360 --> 00:10:13,080</time>
<s>第一个有这个顾虑</s>
<time>291_00:10:13,800 --> 00:10:15,600</time>
<s>那当时给的那个钱挺高的真的</s>
<time>292_00:10:15,960 --> 00:10:17,400</time>
<s>照今天都不低</s>
<time>293_00:10:17,760 --> 00:10:18,120</time>
<s>确实诱惑</s>
<time>294_00:10:18,480 --> 00:10:19,200</time>
<s>关键你拉完以后</s>
<time>295_00:10:19,560 --> 00:10:20,280</time>
<s>眼镜广告不能接了</s>
<time>296_00:10:21,000 --> 00:10:22,800</time>
<s>我觉得我的一个障碍是什么呢</s>
<time>297_00:10:24,240 --> 00:10:26,760</time>
<s>怕丑就是说他给我设计的是</s>
<time>298_00:10:28,200 --> 00:10:29,640</time>
<s>他说我们要放在那个火车站的</s>
<time>299_00:10:30,000 --> 00:10:30,720</time>
<s>那个广告牌上</s>
<time>300_00:10:31,080 --> 00:10:33,600</time>
<s>还有那个机场的广告牌上</s>
<time>301_00:10:33,960 --> 00:10:35,040</time>
<s>然后他要设计一个什么东西</s>
<time>302_00:10:35,400 --> 00:10:36,120</time>
<s>他就是说你想</s>
<time>303_00:10:36,480 --> 00:10:37,200</time>
<s>你现在可以看看</s>
<time>304_00:10:38,280 --> 00:10:39,720</time>
<s>我终于摘掉眼镜了</s>
<time>305_00:10:40,800 --> 00:10:41,160</time>
<s>就这样</s>
<time>306_00:10:42,240 --> 00:10:43,680</time>
<s>就这一幕我接受不了</s>
<time>307_00:10:44,040 --> 00:10:45,840</time>
<s>我接受不了就是说我一下飞机</s>
<time>308_00:10:46,200 --> 00:10:47,640</time>
<s>或者说我一下火车</s>
<time>309_00:10:49,080 --> 00:10:49,800</time>
<s>先看见自己了</s>
<time>310_00:10:50,160 --> 00:10:51,600</time>
<s>不是主要是他这个</s>
<time>311_00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:52,680</time>
<s>你知道吗</s>
<time>312_00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:53,760</time>
<s>那你</s>
<time>313_00:10:55,200 --> 00:10:55,920</time>
<s>不是你可以换一个动作</s>
<time>314_00:10:56,280 --> 00:10:59,160</time>
<s>我发现我对我不认识的人</s>
<time>315_00:10:59,520 --> 00:11:00,240</time>
<s>可以无感</s>
<time>316_00:11:00,600 --> 00:11:02,400</time>
<s>就是说一般人可能特别重视</s>
<time>317_00:11:02,760 --> 00:11:04,200</time>
<s>自己的公众形象</s>
<time>318_00:11:04,560 --> 00:11:07,080</time>
<s>你知道我当时最觉着抬不起头的</s>
<time>319_00:11:07,440 --> 00:11:08,520</time>
<s>是咱们这个朋友圈</s>
<time>320_00:11:08,880 --> 00:11:10,320</time>
<s>那摘掉眼镜有什么不行呢</s>
<time>321_00:11:10,680 --> 00:11:12,120</time>
<s>不是就这样的一个照片</s>
<time>322_00:11:13,200 --> 00:11:16,440</time>
<s>那么大放在那个任何一个场合</s>
<time>323_00:11:16,800 --> 00:11:18,240</time>
<s>我一下想到的就是马爷</s>
<time>324_00:11:18,600 --> 00:11:20,040</time>
<s>或者我身边的很多朋友</s>
<time>325_00:11:20,400 --> 00:11:21,120</time>
<s>大学同学</s>
<time>326_00:11:21,840 --> 00:11:22,200</time>
<s>你比如看见我</s>
<time>327_00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:24,000</time>
<s>得多可笑</s>
<time>328_00:11:24,360 --> 00:11:25,080</time>
<s>人家只有美慕</s>
<time>329_00:11:25,440 --> 00:11:25,800</time>
<s>你知道</s>
<time>330_00:11:26,160 --> 00:11:26,880</time>
<s>这思想包太重了</s>
<time>331_00:11:27,240 --> 00:11:27,960</time>
<s>假如我看到</s>
<time>332_00:11:28,320 --> 00:11:29,040</time>
<s>会怎么想知道吧</s>
<time>333_00:11:30,120 --> 00:11:30,480</time>
<s>你说我也摘</s>
<time>334_00:11:30,840 --> 00:11:33,000</time>
<s>不是怎么没找我</s>
<time>335_00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:34,800</time>
<s>不是不知道这是多少钱</s>
<time>336_00:11:35,520 --> 00:11:36,240</time>
<s>那不是一个意思吗</s>
<time>337_00:11:36,600 --> 00:11:38,400</time>
<s>对那要是钱多的话</s>
<time>338_00:11:38,760 --> 00:11:39,120</time>
<s>摘就摘了</s>
<time>339_00:11:40,200 --> 00:11:42,360</time>
<s>那你要是那个钱是不多的话</s>
<time>340_00:11:42,720 --> 00:11:43,080</time>
<s>那我心里想</s>
<time>341_00:11:43,440 --> 00:11:44,160</time>
<s>那文涛何苦</s>
<time>342_00:11:44,520 --> 00:11:45,240</time>
<s>这点钱没必要</s>
<time>343_00:11:46,680 --> 00:11:48,480</time>
<s>还是在想这个问题你看</s>
<time>344_00:11:48,840 --> 00:11:50,280</time>
<s>所以我在想就体面这个事儿</s>
<time>345_00:11:50,640 --> 00:11:52,080</time>
<s>咱们就是很多时候</s>
<time>346_00:11:52,440 --> 00:11:52,800</time>
<s>就因人而异</s>
<time>347_00:11:53,160 --> 00:11:53,520</time>
<s>因时而异</s>
<time>348_00:11:53,880 --> 00:11:54,240</time>
<s>它的标准不一样</s>
<time>349_00:11:54,600 --> 00:11:55,320</time>
<s>但你刚才说那个</s>
<time>350_00:11:55,680 --> 00:11:56,400</time>
<s>我就有一个感受</s>
<time>351_00:11:56,760 --> 00:11:58,560</time>
<s>就是说它是一个让自己</s>
<time>352_00:11:58,920 --> 00:12:00,360</time>
<s>可能舒服不舒服的这么一条线</s>
<time>353_00:12:00,720 --> 00:12:01,800</time>
<s>对了你真是我的心</s>
<time>354_00:12:02,160 --> 00:12:02,520</time>
<s>是不是</s>
<time>355_00:12:02,880 --> 00:12:04,680</time>
<s>是自己别扭</s>
<time>356_00:12:05,040 --> 00:12:05,400</time>
<s>就是不是</s>
<time>357_00:12:05,760 --> 00:12:06,480</time>
<s>其实说到根本上</s>
<time>358_00:12:06,840 --> 00:12:09,360</time>
<s>就是人是不是有一个自我想象</s>
<time>359_00:12:10,080 --> 00:12:11,520</time>
<s>一个自我的心像</s>
<time>360_00:12:11,880 --> 00:12:14,040</time>
<s>就觉得我怎么能那样呢</s>
<time>361_00:12:14,400 --> 00:12:15,840</time>
<s>因为就是其实许老师刚刚说的</s>
<time>362_00:12:16,200 --> 00:12:17,280</time>
<s>也纳入这个范畴</s>
<time>363_00:12:17,640 --> 00:12:18,360</time>
<s>他觉得比如说</s>
<time>364_00:12:18,720 --> 00:12:19,440</time>
<s>你有一个价格的衡量</s>
<time>365_00:12:19,800 --> 00:12:20,520</time>
<s>它也是一条线</s>
<time>366_00:12:20,880 --> 00:12:22,680</time>
<s>你就是那种丢不丢人的</s>
<time>367_00:12:23,040 --> 00:12:24,480</time>
<s>那么一条线</s>
<time>368_00:12:24,840 --> 00:12:26,640</time>
<s>一个人他可能平时的所作所为</s>
<time>369_00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:28,440</time>
<s>他都已经给自己划定了</s>
<time>370_00:12:28,800 --> 00:12:29,520</time>
<s>一个大概的一个阈值</s>
<time>371_00:12:29,880 --> 00:12:30,600</time>
<s>一个范围</s>
<time>372_00:12:30,960 --> 00:12:32,400</time>
<s>突破那个那就是叫</s>
<time>373_00:12:32,760 --> 00:12:33,840</time>
<s>他自已觉得就不体面</s>
<time>374_00:12:34,200 --> 00:12:35,640</time>
<s>这就是我原来说</s>
<time>375_00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:36,720</time>
<s>人生第一个刚才我们说</s>
<time>376_00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:38,160</time>
<s>第一个目标是趋利</s>
<time>377_00:12:38,520 --> 00:12:40,320</time>
<s>第二个目标就是趋名</s>
<time>378_00:12:40,680 --> 00:12:41,760</time>
<s>你这开始到趋名这个阶段</s>
<time>379_00:12:42,120 --> 00:12:43,560</time>
<s>你趋利那个阶段过了</s>
<time>380_00:12:43,920 --> 00:12:44,640</time>
<s>谁说的我现在</s>
<time>381_00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:45,360</time>
<s>我说的</s>
<time>382_00:12:45,720 --> 00:12:47,160</time>
<s>我长期有价无市</s>
<time>383_00:12:47,520 --> 00:12:48,600</time>
<s>马爷我不是不做</s>
<time>384_00:12:48,960 --> 00:12:50,400</time>
<s>不要给我形成这种误解</s>
<time>385_00:12:50,760 --> 00:12:51,840</time>
<s>你为什么趋名</s>
<time>386_00:12:52,200 --> 00:12:53,640</time>
<s>趋名不代表说你不在乎利</s>
<time>387_00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:56,520</time>
<s>而是你在乎别人对你的看法了</s>
<time>388_00:12:56,880 --> 00:12:58,320</time>
<s>这肯定是进入第二个阶段了</s>
<time>389_00:12:58,680 --> 00:12:59,400</time>
<s>你如果没到</s>
<time>390_00:12:59,760 --> 00:13:01,200</time>
<s>就是你的生活状态</s>
<time>391_00:13:01,560 --> 00:13:02,280</time>
<s>非常恶劣的时候</s>
<time>392_00:13:02,640 --> 00:13:04,440</time>
<s>你永远不管别人怎么看你对不对</s>
<time>393_00:13:05,160 --> 00:13:06,600</time>
<s>我说人生第一个目标是趋利</s>
<time>394_00:13:06,960 --> 00:13:08,400</time>
<s>是趋到你对应的利</s>
<time>395_00:13:08,760 --> 00:13:09,480</time>
<s>什么叫对应的利</s>
<time>396_00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:11,280</time>
<s>比如有人说我有一份好工作</s>
<time>397_00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:12,360</time>
<s>工资我已经满意了</s>
<time>398_00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:15,240</time>
<s>不一定非得成为首富对吧</s>
<time>399_00:13:15,600 --> 00:13:16,320</time>
<s>不是我们老宣传的</s>
<time>400_00:13:16,680 --> 00:13:18,480</time>
<s>什么小目标什么的</s>
<time>401_00:13:18,840 --> 00:13:19,200</time>
<s>不是这个</s>
<time>402_00:13:19,560 --> 00:13:22,080</time>
<s>而是有人认为我就挣这点儿钱</s>
<time>403_00:13:22,440 --> 00:13:23,160</time>
<s>但我生活很安定</s>
<time>404_00:13:23,520 --> 00:13:25,680</time>
<s>这也是趋到对应的利的时候</s>
<time>405_00:13:26,040 --> 00:13:26,760</time>
<s>他一定是趋名</s>
<time>406_00:13:27,120 --> 00:13:27,840</time>
<s>什么叫趋名呢</s>
<time>407_00:13:28,200 --> 00:13:29,640</time>
<s>他首先要在乎亲戚朋友</s>
<time>408_00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:32,160</time>
<s>最近的人对我是什么看法</s>
<time>409_00:13:32,520 --> 00:13:33,600</time>
<s>如果你的名声过大</s>
<time>410_00:13:33,960 --> 00:13:34,320</time>
<s>你要在乎</s>
<time>411_00:13:34,680 --> 00:13:36,480</time>
<s>公众对我的什么看法对吧</s>
<time>412_00:13:36,840 --> 00:13:37,560</time>
<s>你再大你要考虑</s>
<time>413_00:13:37,920 --> 00:13:39,720</time>
<s>国家对我什么看法</s>
<time>414_00:13:40,080 --> 00:13:42,600</time>
<s>那肯定都是趋名阶段了对吧</s>
<time>415_00:13:42,960 --> 00:13:43,320</time>
<s>这个很正常</s>
<time>416_00:13:43,680 --> 00:13:46,200</time>
<s>我们的人性的基本点叫趋利避害</s>
<time>417_00:13:47,640 --> 00:13:49,080</time>
<s>其实趋利都是要的</s>
<time>418_00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:50,520</time>
<s>但是你还要想到一个</s>
<time>419_00:13:50,880 --> 00:13:51,600</time>
<s>这会不会给你带来坏处</s>
<time>420_00:13:53,040 --> 00:13:54,480</time>
<s>所以你比方说</s>
<time>421_00:13:54,840 --> 00:13:56,640</time>
<s>你觉得有损你的形象</s>
<time>422_00:13:57,000 --> 00:13:59,160</time>
<s>这个就是你会觉得这个是个害处</s>
<time>423_00:13:59,520 --> 00:14:02,760</time>
<s>但是你知道最冤的马爷</s>
<time>424_00:14:03,120 --> 00:14:04,560</time>
<s>我真的觉得就是说怎么回事儿</s>
<time>425_00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:08,880</time>
<s>我觉得我对这个社会的很多变化</s>
<time>426_00:14:09,240 --> 00:14:11,400</time>
<s>有的人的态度我倒也佩服</s>
<time>427_00:14:11,760 --> 00:14:12,840</time>
<s>说哥们儿不跟了</s>
<time>428_00:14:13,200 --> 00:14:15,720</time>
<s>那就是保持这个操守对吧</s>
<time>429_00:14:16,080 --> 00:14:17,520</time>
<s>有的人这个操守甚至能够到什么</s>
<time>430_00:14:18,960 --> 00:14:20,760</time>
<s>他认为上媒体都丢人</s>
<time>431_00:14:21,480 --> 00:14:22,920</time>
<s>这个社会有这样的知识分子</s>
<time>432_00:14:23,640 --> 00:14:25,080</time>
<s>那当然你也没有什么合理性</s>
<time>433_00:14:25,800 --> 00:14:27,240</time>
<s>但是人家自己愿意把这个</s>
<time>434_00:14:27,600 --> 00:14:31,200</time>
<s>当成一个荣辱的一个个人的持守</s>
<time>435_00:14:31,560 --> 00:14:32,280</time>
<s>很多我们这一行很多</s>
<time>436_00:14:32,640 --> 00:14:33,720</time>
<s>我的同行很多</s>
<time>437_00:14:34,440 --> 00:14:35,520</time>
<s>比如说咱们现在节目里</s>
